if you ever want to give me that set up your putting in for the same price you got it..i'll be sure to make good use of it justin

By Justin (199.60.112.10) on Friday, March 26, 2004 - 07:35 pm:

She has had the caddy for years...it's been off the road for over 4, it's been painted twice since we took it off the road the carpet(Mercedes benz black wool)and the vinyl back wall are done. It has a 16v. pumping out 172hp to the wheels, porsche boxster S rotors/calipers.. i just need the time to finish it off.. wire up the motor/A2 dash swap/front and rear disc swap etc etc.. But she would rather spend the money on the house right now

By Charles R. (12.72.198.165) on Thursday, March 25, 2004 - 10:33 pm:

A Caddy for Twyla, Justin?

Considering how well the Hondas turn out, I can't wait to see what you have planned for that one.

I'm finishing up a 2000 VW 1.8T swap into a 1990 Corrado right now. Currently it's all "stock" to attempt to pass the strict California smog referee. But later it will recieve a bump in displacement, and a turbo upgrade that's been proven to put out about 300 ponies.

By chris ingham (Cingham) (207.69.139.136) on Thursday, March 25, 2004 - 10:07 pm:

I'd never turbo a honda motor without building it. People say blah blah blah 8psi they will hold...but you just invested over 2200 in a swap, and your going to blow it up now. if you like blowing cash go for it.

Low compression is the way to with the turbos, allmotor higher is nice. Most people stick with some stock parts like the crank, but everything else goes to aftermarket. Like my friend Brandon bought his bottom end from JG and spent 3k on just that, while my other friend built his motor by him self and spent only around 4k.

A d15b is a economical motor, and we blow them up when we are bored

By Parker (24.98.213.4) on Thursday, March 25, 2004 - 09:48 pm:

you are partially correct that you would need to lower compression, however, you could leave it with stock compression, but more accurate tuning would need to be done. the main thing you will have to worry about with boost is the stock d15 rods, they are pinky finger thin.

By Colza (219.88.31.202) on Thursday, March 25, 2004 - 07:13 pm:

And this on whether to do a B18C conversion or a turbo:

"...it will cost like 2500 to b18c and go piss all faster and boost on a d15b will beat an average b18c in my opinion."

By Colza (219.88.31.202) on Thursday, March 25, 2004 - 07:01 pm:

http://www.nzhondas.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=17412&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=d15b+vtec&start=0

This engine? That was exactly what i found out last night and i was going to post it but my computer died a horribled death. Looks rather tasty, especially this bit about the d15b turbo: "...still economical, reliable, and more power than B16A & B18C at low boost."

What sort of compression do they run? I should imagine I will be looking at some decompression before any serious boost gets stuffed in there. Definately looking at the VTEC's, but will the 1600 be more suitable for boost? They rev a bit higher i think, about 8000 instead of 7200...

By Parker (24.98.213.4) on Thursday, March 25, 2004 - 06:58 am:

also colza, you were talking about the vtec 1500 engine, if you could get ahold of one with 3 stage vtec, it would fit much more easily than these other swaps, and would be lighter and still have about as much power as the ZC, and you would get excellent fuel mileage too! here is a link on some info about VTEC

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/question229.htm

By Parker (24.98.213.4) on Thursday, March 25, 2004 - 06:53 am:

VTEC is purely for street use. its meant as a driveability enhancer so you can have good performance up top as well. if this isnt going to be a daily driver, you might as well go non-vtec and get yourself a set of cams, and do a little work to the engine with the money you save. non vtec motors can often be found for $100-200 or sometimes even free from people who are doing VTEC swaps. if i had the room or the time(or funds for that matter), id put a B18b(non vtec) into my wagon or a 5th gen hatch, put stronger internals in it, and boost the crap outta it!

By Colza (210.54.103.6) on Thursday, March 25, 2004 - 02:37 am:

VTEC sensor? Im new to VTEC, do enlighten me...

The DOHC would fill the engine bay up nicely, but would be much harder to make room for.
The VTEC would be more fun to drive as NA while i get the turbo sorted.
VTEC heads flow better? VTEC's as a general rule have stronger internals, but i have also read that all ZC short blocks are the same?
The Civic Si box will bolt to both. Was it one that came with LSD?
Not sure what cars we got here, with what engines (in NZ), found that we did get a version of both the 1500 and 1600 SOHC VTEC though.
What would the compression ratio's be like for the VTEC vs. DOHC? VTEC's are higher compression arent they (not so good for turbo)? However they also rev to somewhere in the 8000's....

Hmmm, much thought will have to go into this i think.

By chris ingham (Cingham) (207.69.139.156) on Thursday, March 25, 2004 - 01:03 am:

1.6 DOHC is going to cream a SOHC..but when you put turbos in the mix I personally don't know. I personally favor non vtec motors, but thats becasue if you price that vtec sensor your going to hate vtec real fast.

By Colza (219.88.29.79) on Thursday, March 25, 2004 - 12:55 am:

The big question is, what will make more power? A SOHC VTEC 1600, or a DOHC non-VTEC 1600....

VTEC works very well with turbo's does it not? But will the extra adjustability of the DOHC head be capable of more power in the end?

Talking stock internals for the moment, but possibly a link ecu. The DOHC would be heavier too wont it?

By chris ingham (Cingham) (207.69.139.135) on Wednesday, March 24, 2004 - 09:47 pm:

there was a SOHC minime turbo set up cvcc on ebay a little while ago. i'm really surprised at how much it went for.

The mini me swap is fairly simple + cheap to do. Plus most people that have the parts are so cheap that it can come to be really afordable for anyone

By Colza (210.54.193.242) on Wednesday, March 24, 2004 - 02:33 am:

As far as the swap goes, I think i am definately warming to the idea of the SOHC VTEC with a turbo. With any luck it should be much more reliable than a crappy old EL accord with a sodding great big turbo on it....

By Colza (210.54.193.242) on Wednesday, March 24, 2004 - 02:28 am:

Crack out the old crank handle! Worked briliantly a little while back, 'bout time for a revival :-P You gotta admit it would look pretty impressive in a parking lot:
Rumage around in the boot a bit. Come back with a great big, garage built crank-handle. Flip down front grill, clip it on and...
VVVRRROOOOOOMMMMMMMM
burble burble burble etc.

By chris ingham (Cingham) (207.69.139.156) on Tuesday, March 23, 2004 - 12:10 pm:

weight compared to the zc and a b16 is considerable. I can lift a d16a by my self..need a skate board for a zc and b16 i need a rolling dolly.

Your right on the adapter plate for the supra/lexus swap. But at the same time is on the movement of i believe two bolts for that. With the honda, u have to make mods to the starter as well due to the fact that it won't line up at all. When you go to start it all you hear is the spinning of the starter. Hence the pull starter people have made.

By Justin (199.60.112.10) on Tuesday, March 23, 2004 - 10:11 am:

Lookin good I won't be starting the B16 swap this year.. We need to buy a house (why rent a shop when I can put the money into a mortgage) And the first project to do is Twyla's VW pick-up.. so she has given me the go-ahead to get my wagon back on the road(rear nsx brakes/new interior/system..maybe the turbo set-up I have sitting around )I'm not spending much money on it, so it's okay

By Parker (24.98.213.4) on Tuesday, March 23, 2004 - 09:26 am:

im not sure that there is any way you are getting the H22 into that engine bay without more work than you are looking to do. not sure how much more a B weighs than a D, but i do know i could feel the weight difference on the engine hoist between my EN1 and the ZC, and let me tell you, the ZC must be 100+ pounds lighter! it set my front end back to stock ride height after i lowered it about 5cm

By Kyle Wesolowski (Weezo182) (164.58.208.245) on Tuesday, March 23, 2004 - 08:16 am:

ooo thats a nice swap im looking to swap a b16 i have into my 81 accord if cleaning it up right now and looking for some one with a garage to help.... if any one can help me with the wireing in my cd player i would love some.... my AIM is weezo182 thanks

By Colza (219.88.32.107) on Tuesday, March 23, 2004 - 01:40 am:

Im sure ive seen street-legal cars with adapter-plated boxes. I thought the standard way of getting a manual transmision onto a Lexus V8 was to use a plate to get a Supra 6-speed on....

By chris ingham (Cingham) (207.69.139.136) on Monday, March 22, 2004 - 09:39 pm:

lol no its not a best option....I just say we use/see it when we are at pomona some people do it, but I would'nt suggest it unless you car is going to be a track car

By Colza (210.54.193.171) on Monday, March 22, 2004 - 09:02 pm:

So best option for putting in a B series would be to get a D series tranny on with an adapter plate, and use some appropriate drivshafts. And you can also mix and match ratio's by pinching gears off other D series boxes...

Sounds interesting.

I was planning on going with a turbo EL setup, but this looks like an interesting project. Nowhere near as cheap and straoght forward as the EL, but MUCH more interesting.

How much does a B series weigh compared to an EL? What about an H22? (just for comparisons sake :-D )

By Parker (24.98.213.4) on Monday, March 22, 2004 - 08:40 pm:

yeah, but with the adapter plate you would definitely want to keep the d-series tranny, using different gears from different d-series cars can yeild a tranny with ratio's that would make any ITR or bseries engine weep for mercy!

By chris ingham (Cingham) (207.69.139.145) on Monday, March 22, 2004 - 03:12 pm:

the zc is a d-series motor (Black top NOT BROWN TOP), so ya it matches up to a cable d-series tranny with no probs.
Now NOTE:
YOU CAN put a d-series on a b-series motor as well as a b-series on to an H/F...all it requires is a adapter plate. There are some IDHC racers that do that for the track and pull start it. But again...thats a track car, I would'nt suggest that on a daily/autocross car.

The splines are the same except i beleive if its an auto, but I think i'm wrong there. Thats why i think we might be able to get away with finding a shorter combination of axels to make it work.
Once u have a d-series motor BASE on the d-series mounts from there if u wanted to could just get some after market mounts and use those (in theory). Then the linkage would need to be shortened/moved over again. And the axels combo would have to either be fab'ed or made

By Parker (24.98.213.4) on Monday, March 22, 2004 - 03:09 pm:

yes and no, the si tranny will fit the zc motor, but you must use the 2nd gen driveshafts. you cant retain the original ZC intermediate shaft on an si transmission. if you wanted to use the zc transmission, you would need custom axles made.. for a b16/18/whatever, you would NOT be able to use the crx si transmission, you would have to use the one for the b-motor. the axles from the 2nd gen, as far as i know, are a different spline count than what is needed to fit into the b-tranny.

By Colza (130.123.225.69) on Monday, March 22, 2004 - 01:23 pm:

Lets see if i've got this right:

The CRX si tranny fits the ZC and the 2g driveshafts.

The splines on the cv's for the B16/18/20 are the same as the splines on the ZC, and will work with xxx gearbox.

And, if you already have a D-series in there, then you should be able to upgrade to a B without too much more messing around....

By chris ingham (Cingham) (207.69.139.146) on Sunday, March 21, 2004 - 11:41 pm:

When you do a swap in say a crx the only thing that is required to make it fit is to bash in the driver side so that the alternator can fit...other wise it fits in no problems. They use the 90-93 integra axels and the only mod needed to make them fit is removal of the dust ring inside the spindle.

a b18/16/20 should fit with a little mod, but if you are going with a d-series first then the only thing after fitting that one in is to make room for the B-altenator...its a snug fit too in the crx so i would'nt doubt the same for the cvcc.

Axels pretty much done by cutting them in half welding them together w/ a sleave. Then either rock those or get some new ones made...I still think that the 88-89 integra might actually be small enough to work, but i want to try some other as well.

By Parker (24.98.213.4) on Sunday, March 21, 2004 - 01:43 pm:

its pretty much the same swap as Justin's car(it will fit, just a little more work), only i do have the 2nd gen, and my axles fit perfectly. it would bolt up to the shuttle tranny, im just not sure how much room you would have for that in a 1st gen, as it was tight in this engine bay.

im not sure what you mean by the b16 fitting the ZC box, but nothing for the b16 save the rocker cover studs and throttle body will fit the zc. i couldnt use the ZC transmission, i ended up using a 90 crx si transmission for ease of using the stock axles instead of having custom ones made up.

By chris ingham (Cingham) (65.179.241.112) on Sunday, March 21, 2004 - 01:21 pm:

anything can done with a little bit of $ and attention

By Colza (130.123.225.69) on Sunday, March 21, 2004 - 01:07 pm:

That looks mighty fine there mate! I thought you had a 1st gen... looks like 2g engine bay isnt it?

That rocker cover looks very much like the ones they put on the civic shuttles with the 4WD tranny.... any hopes of a bolt up there???

Will a B16 fit onto a ZC box?

And last of the many questions: will it fit in a 1st gen? If 2g driveshafts fit, then 1g driveshafts will fit wont they. Looks liker a bit of a squeeze into there so i take it there would be a bit more cutting if you were gonna fit it into a 1st gen. Has anyone here done it?

By chris ingham (Cingham) (207.69.139.146) on Sunday, March 21, 2004 - 02:26 am:

nice pictures...when anyone steps up to the b16..pls take or make detail instruckions on the axels...but to be honest i really think we can getg a way w/ using 88-89 axles for it...but who knows...soon my friends soon

By Parker (24.98.213.4) on Saturday, March 20, 2004 - 05:26 pm:

stock driveshafts they fit perfectly, and here is the link to where all the pictures are. the mounts might not be pretty, but they sure as heck won't fail!!!

http://pub161.ezboard.com/fbseriesalternativefrm18.showMessageRange?topicID=29.topic&start=21&stop=21

By Colza (210.54.193.198) on Saturday, March 20, 2004 - 04:15 pm:

Just quickly, what do your engine mounts look like now? And what do you have to do to your poor driveshafts???

By Parker (24.98.213.4) on Saturday, March 20, 2004 - 12:27 pm:

thats a DOHC ZC motor, 1.6L 137ps, 106lb-ft stock


it was no picnic getting everything in, and despite what you may hear about the wiring, the fuel line plumbing was the hardest , most frustrating part of the whole swap.(to me at least.

By DåRl{ (66.50.183.94) on Saturday, March 20, 2004 - 12:24 pm:

Hey Parker...What's that engine You have mounted in there?

By Parker (24.98.213.4) on Saturday, March 20, 2004 - 11:09 am:

well there she is, just waiting to be figured out...

By chris ingham (Cingham) (207.69.139.145) on Saturday, March 20, 2004 - 09:34 am:

eh they both have thier moments...ps going off memory for that one....have you done a volt test on the distributor, should be a blue wire? who did the wiring for the zc? sohc or dohc?

either way it should be pumping at least 10v throguh the blue (might be a black and white wire)

By Parker (24.98.213.4) on Friday, March 19, 2004 - 11:29 pm:

15 is faulty ignition output signal, have no clue what it could be, im not getting a code for the cam angle sensor, or anything else, just this pesky ignition output crap...


trust me Robert, staying with carbs is much simpler...

By chris ingham (Cingham) (207.69.139.156) on Friday, March 19, 2004 - 09:28 pm:

I can't remember who it was that has the site, but most of my cvcc sites are all broken links. I think its not that bad of a swap, just do a search and i'm sure there are a bunch of people here that can help....sorry i'm a fuel injected baby

By Robert Waggoner (Towboat) (209.39.210.76) on Friday, March 19, 2004 - 07:36 pm:

Hello to all, I'm a noobie, my question is if there is a site that might rate the difficulty of swaps from one model to another. I have an '81 hatch that has been oil starved due to a clogged oil filter. I will be looking at an '85 prelude as a donor car soon, if it has agood engine does any one know if an ET2 dual side draft 1.8L 12V motor would fit in the engine bay?

By chris ingham (Cingham) (207.69.139.145) on Friday, March 19, 2004 - 06:12 pm:

cam angle sensor is 15 right?

If it is then you just need the peice that fits on the front of the zc where normal b18's just have a plastic cover there is a huge sensor, just replace that and it causes a world of pain to be gone

By Parker (24.98.213.4) on Friday, March 19, 2004 - 03:58 pm:

well my zc swap is done, all i need is to figure out this code 15 crap it keeps feeding me, then ill be on the road. its got fuel, air, compression, but no spark, and ive changed the distributor for a KNOWN working one. im getting more than a little irritated.

that and i seem to have lost the faceplate to my CD player! BLAST!

By Kurt (142.179.34.133) on Friday, March 19, 2004 - 01:53 pm:

I may be comng down but for this one the car will be staying home

By chris ingham (Cingham) (207.69.139.156) on Friday, March 19, 2004 - 10:56 am:

HAHAHA i dropped my girl friend off at the pool like the second week of this job, 50k+ is to nice to wait for immaturity to grow up. So there is another fish for all ya'll.

I think as soon as its got the fuel it will take off from there, but then again I might be moving in 6-9 months down to vegas to open a new office.
Congrads!!!!

ps writing this on a handheld so might not be the best of grammar/spelling -0

By scholzj (67.171.200.238) on Friday, March 19, 2004 - 10:55 am:

hey kurt were you planing on coming to the oergon meet? and if so are you bringing that car? cause it would be cool to see what swaps people are doing.
Jeremy

By Kurt (142.179.34.133) on Friday, March 19, 2004 - 02:43 am:

Mines done

Just have to fit the dual carbs and have the car painted - just in time for summer

Don't feel too bad, I was supposed to be done this time last year. My wife is real impressed.

- Kurt

By chris ingham (Cingham) (207.69.139.145) on Friday, March 19, 2004 - 01:10 am:

Well the wagon is taking for ever since I got a new job and work 6 days a week. Its coming, but going to take longer then i was hoping..May is just around the corner, doubt its going to be finshed by then.
Anywho hows everyone elses swaps going