I just bought a perfectly stock 77 4speed CA-highAltittude cvcc civic from the original owner, who was 93 years old. the car is unbelievably clean inside and out, because it was always garaged, and always serviced according to the book and papers. When I drove it back from the bay area to my home in Northern Nevada, I drove about 70 to 75 mph all the way home. I accelerated easily up long I-80 hills. I got 35 mph on that trip. So apparrently my car was a bit of a find. I'd like to do some simple mods to it, but only if I don't loose too much economy. I'll start with plugs, wires, coil, and replace points with the pertronix thing. I'm considering going to the Weber that Bruce has, especially if I can maintain fuel economy. Anybody know how much that might cost me? I'm no pro mechanically. I also want to put a 5speed in it. My engine is 1500 EB-3. What would my options be for a new tranny, and would that affect what Carb i should get? Any info would be great, thanks!

By osminsd@aol.com (198.81.26.75) on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 12:13 am:

Finaly I'm getting great gas miliage on my Hondamatic Wagon. I topped off at $22 bucks for a full tank at Costco, drove the car up and down the Southern California freeways at about 70mph, when I was done, my trip meter read 280miles. That's excellent for doing 70mph on the freeways. So that's about 28 miles per gallon. Not bad for a hondamatic if I may say so. Oh, I was also hauling in the back area a compressor that weight at least 150 pounds and a suction turbine that weighs 50 pounds. My best guess for the increase gas miliage is to avoid driving over 80mph, get fresh coolant, new water pump, new 170F thermostat, new oil change, new transmission oil change, new spark plugs and just relax, enjoy the ride and let the speedsters pass by.

By bruce (4.252.198.76) on Tuesday, November 09, 2004 - 07:07 pm:

1500 right now...building a 1751 to put in

By Jarcaf (Jarcaf) (207.55.238.216) on Tuesday, November 09, 2004 - 04:56 pm:

huh, are you running on a 1200? I suppose it wouldn't really make much difference as compared to an EK.

By bruce (4.159.183.101) on Tuesday, November 09, 2004 - 03:37 am:

jarcaf, my foot is always in the gas

By Jarcaf (Jarcaf) (207.55.238.216) on Monday, November 08, 2004 - 02:51 pm:

one of these days I'll try backing my foot off the pedal for an entire tank of gas and drive it like my mom drives the minivan. Maybe that'll give me a more reasonable figure(hopefully closer to what your getting Bruce). As of now, I'm still getting about the same as our '00 Odyssey @ 21 mpg.

By bruce (66.20.225.200) on Monday, November 08, 2004 - 10:14 am:

checked my gas mileage yesteray, getting about 336 miles per tank, thats about 36 mpg, and I am running a weber 32/36 on a cvcc.

By Kurt (205.250.75.226) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 11:31 am:

With my dual Dellortos on the EL I am getting about 300kms (or 186 miles) to a tank...whatever that converts to for miles per gallon?

- Kurt

By osminsd@aol.com (68.7.165.149) on Thursday, November 04, 2004 - 06:44 pm:

any know how this carburetor would work on a 1500 CVCC civic? Anyone running this webber set-up?

By Jarcaf (Jarcaf) (207.55.238.216) on Thursday, November 04, 2004 - 12:31 am:

cool, I guess i'll have to accept the consequences of the enthusiastic driver. 200-250 miles/tank. What really bugs me though is that my fuel qauge is melted down. It's funny to see the little droopy gas pump symbol even if it is useless. reminds me of Salvador Dali's melting clocks

By osminsd@aol.com (68.7.165.149) on Wednesday, November 03, 2004 - 11:30 pm:

I'd like photos of that rebuild for the carb. Roger

By Chaffneue (Chaffneue) (66.183.190.188) on Wednesday, November 03, 2004 - 08:49 pm:

I think I've figured it out.. the float wasn't adjusted properly (Out by about an inch) and gas was pooling in the manifold when I stopped the car. I think I've got it sorted out now.. I'll do a milage test with the rebuilt carb and let everyone know if it made a difference. Randy, I took pictures of everything involved in rebuilding the carb.. do you want them for 1stgencivic.com once I've got it all back together and running?

-Richard

By osminsd@aol.com (68.7.165.149) on Wednesday, November 03, 2004 - 07:40 pm:

I own a 1978 Honda Civic CVCC hatchback 1500. If I topped off at $19.00 of gas, and drove that car, constantly at 75mph, I got approximatly 280 miles to the tank, once I even got 300 miles for one tank, but I was driving 65 mph. So I assume that if I were to drive 55mph, then I would average about 350 miles. This was a 4 speed manual car also. So I figured that a 5 speed would easily get 400 to 450 miles per full tank. Now, most of us want to drive these Honda Civic's at about 80mph, so that means we'll only get about 200 miles per tank, maybe 220 miles. I know own two wagons and I average about 200 miles per full tank, sometimes 220 when I take it easy. I figured that this is the average of the Hondas since I push them to keep up with modern car traffic. So this means that if you want to have a fuel effecient 70's Honda Civic, drive 55 mph on the freeway and get yourself a 5 speed tranny. Otherwise, get some fiber glass panels and hood, get rid of the rear seat and spare tire to save on weight.

By Jarcaf (Jarcaf) (207.55.238.216) on Monday, November 01, 2004 - 11:00 am:

Shouldn't i be able to get anything over 20 mpg with a weber on my EK1. The guys at redline claim that the 32/36 saves gas, but i'm definitely not seeing that. Maybe they didn't account for the loss of the cvcc system? Thanks,
-Jarvis

By Sheldon Hildebrand (207.6.78.29) on Monday, August 09, 2004 - 02:20 pm:

i got a qurkey question for ya i was driving alond parked my 81 civic wagon with a 5 speed left it fo a while got back in hit the highway and noticed that i was lacking power in 4th. Now i repaced the batery spark plugs and wires, and still lacking the umph i had when i bought it.
What could be the problem i need to fing out cuz it afecting my milage.

By Chaffneue (Chaffneue) (64.180.112.150) on Friday, June 18, 2004 - 11:26 pm:

Well I started shifting into 4th and there's very little difference at the pump maybe a quarter liter.. the thermostat, tuning and points are next.. should I have the tuning (I'll probably replace the timing belt) done at a shop? or should I do it myself?

Thanks for your help, guys..

-Richard

By Jonathan (68.193.10.141) on Friday, June 18, 2004 - 10:38 pm:

True, true, my 454 and a holley gets around the single digits for gas mileage. 4:10's don't help much either for fuel economy, but they're still a blast to drive!

By Puff (24.81.182.61) on Friday, June 18, 2004 - 08:31 pm:

I havent really worked out my milage to any real extent but I am running an accord 1.6 with a weber In my 78 and get 350 to 385 km per tank. The way I look at it is that nomatter how hard I drive it or what mods are done its still cheaper than a 454 and Holley

By Adrian (Evocivic) (141.168.23.86) on Tuesday, June 15, 2004 - 12:22 am:

Thermostats cost a few $ from any car parts shop. To check it just remove the air cleaner housing, drain the cooling system and take off the thermostat cover (on top of the inlet manifold). If it hasn't been off for a long time be careful you don't break the bolts.

You're driving a car that had maybe 50hp when new. Probably a fair bit less now that it's well worn and even less if badly tuned. Don't expect spectacular performance from it.

By Chaffneue (Chaffneue) (64.180.112.150) on Monday, June 14, 2004 - 11:30 pm:

Just for shits and giggles, how hard is it to check the thermostat? Do I have to dedicate a few hours to such a project? are thermostats readily available?
4th gear for 35mph seems kinda gutless.. I guess I didn't want to be constantly reminded that I was saving gas. This motor has lots of miles on it, so I'm all ears.

-Richard

By juan salguero (69.109.46.249) on Monday, June 14, 2004 - 11:29 pm:

maniwish i had could get at least 23 miles per galon im luckiy to get 19 with the webber and the shorty headers in my cvcc how can i improve my gas milege

By Andrew Fatseas (203.63.44.193) on Monday, June 14, 2004 - 06:00 pm:

Another point to mention is that Chaffneue's description of their driving style suggests "enthusiastic". The fuel consumption figures quoted by manufacturers are achieved by driving the car as gently as possible with the windows all wound up.

By Adrian (Evocivic) (141.168.23.86) on Monday, June 14, 2004 - 05:34 pm:

Why are you driving around in 3rd gear? Even at those sorts of speeds you should definitely be in 4th. These cars have very low gearing and are happy to drive around slowly in top gear. My road car has an EN 5-speed in it (one of the later ones with tall gearing) and I putter around at those sorts of speeds in fifth.
Being a 77 model it should have a 4th gear leanout solenoid on the carb. There should be a switch on the end of the gearbox that activates the solenoid when in 4th gear. I'm not sure exactly which fuel circuit it affect but it leans out the mixture in some way for improved economy when cruising. Maybe this isn't working?
You should also definitely not be driving around with the choke on. One thing to note about these cars is that if your heater valve works (i.e. it actually stops water flow through the heater) and the heater bypass pipe is blocked (they always are) then the temp. gauge won't work too well. Because of the sender's location location in the inlet manifold it gets no flow past it unless the heater is slightly on so the gauge often reads wrong. Crack the heater open a tiny bit and watch the needle jump.
For those who are wondering where the heater bypass is as there are no other pipes around ... have you looked at the steel pipes that the rubber heater hoses connect to to pass through the firewall? There is a tiny joiner between the two pipes which is in fact a hollow pipe (very narrow). I've never seen one of these not blocked up.

Just for interests sake, my car uses about 6.5l/100km (equates to approx 36mpg) on the highway. This is sitting on 110km/h in 5th. The engine is a 1335 with head work, cam, twin carbs, 4-2-1 exhaust and is no slouch when pushed (actually it uses hardly any more fuel when on a good fang in the country).

By Jonathan (68.193.10.141) on Monday, June 14, 2004 - 04:10 pm:

Richard, it does sound like you have an open thermostat. You should have the ~1/2 way up on the gauge when you're driving or when you're idling. My car acted the same as yours, warmed up when idling, dropped much cooler when moving, and this is what I found:

By Chaffneue (Chaffneue) (64.180.112.150) on Monday, June 14, 2004 - 03:58 pm:

If I'm sitting in traffic, the temp gauge has gotten as high as just a bit past the halfway mark on the speedo and occasionally hits 3/4 on the really hot days in stop and go. The fan comes on, water moves through the rad once it hits a certain point, so I think the thermostat is okay. I just did the coolant and oil, so it could be running a little cooler than a car with old oil and coolant in it..

-Richard

By Jonathan (66.252.173.251) on Monday, June 14, 2004 - 02:05 pm:

Richard, you might want to change the thermostat if you have time. The car should be warming up more than just above the first line on the temp. gauge. That's where mine was with a bad thermostat. If you let the car idle for a while, does the temperature gauge climb higher? Did you happen to notice if the fan ever comes on?

By Chaffneue (Chaffneue) (64.180.112.150) on Monday, June 14, 2004 - 01:46 pm:

not much of a difference at the first notch (unless I'm warming up the car). If I pull it out too far the ride gets all herky jerky.. I might lower the idle speed a tad just in case it's too high, not much I can screw up there is there? I guess I'll lay off the pedal to the metal in first gear too..

-Richard

By Jonathan (66.252.173.251) on Monday, June 14, 2004 - 12:22 pm:

That engine temp seems to be a little low. Does the car seem to run a little better with the choke out to the first notch? I think normal operating temperature is a little less than 1/2 way up the gauge.

Have you checked the points for pitting/proper gap?

By Chaffneue (Chaffneue) (64.180.112.150) on Monday, June 14, 2004 - 12:17 pm:

New tires with proper pressure
Did the cap/rotor/plugs
timing belt seems to be tight, no backfires.
the engine temp is usually just a smidge past the first mark on the dial.
For this test I was driving the car like I normally would. a few trips to work and some highway runs. I've got a 4 speed gearbox. in town it's about 35mph so I stay in 3rd. On the highway it's about 55mph and I shift to 4th. I might have a case of lead foot, but the car likes to be revved in order to get off the line quickly.. I'm usually shifting when the engine note gets to a certain point. It might bea good idea to buy a tacho one of these days.

-Richard

By Jonathan (66.252.173.251) on Monday, June 14, 2004 - 12:01 pm:

Richard, here's a few things to check:
Tire pressure - too low will hurt fuel economy
plugs, wires should be in good shape, along with the points, cap, rotor
When the choke is being used, yes, more fuel is going to go into the engine. You shouldn't need it once the car warms up
loose timing belt - can let the timing be off
Driving style can also dramatically affect your mileage. How fast were you traveling? Best speed to go is about 50 mph for best economy. On the one tank of gas I put in my Civic (so far), I averaged 22 mpg, but that was before new plugs, wires, cap, rotor, etc. The engine was also running cold because the thermostat fell apart. That has an impact on fuel economy too. Warmer engines will get you better mileage than an engine running too cold.

By Chaffneue (Chaffneue) (64.180.112.150) on Monday, June 14, 2004 - 11:41 am:

Sorry the car is a stock 77 1200 EB-2 with a Keihin carb on it.

-Richard

By Chaffneue (Chaffneue) (64.180.112.150) on Monday, June 14, 2004 - 11:40 am:

Hey Guys. I've been getting kind of low milage on the Honda recently. I filled the tank all the way full and drove about 100km. I refilled it to full and it took 10 Litres of Gas, about (23mpg). That's not all that good. The car runs fine from what I can tell (idle speed may be a bit high, but I don't have a tachometer to be sure). Anything I can do to get to the mythical 30-40mpg advertised by Honda? Does choking use significantly more fuel? Is this about right for these cars? I'm kind of a noob wtill.. just logged my first 1000km yesterday.

-Richard